dmt

[skagardener]

as far as that goes, i would never take anything that changes my overall state of mind, im still the same asshole nomatter what goes on. and i try to stay unmedicated as much as possible, but with bipolar disorder, there is a subdivision of bi polar that is seasonal bipolar, and basically season affects the disorder, winter is my bad time, so the trileptal is just a temporary thing, maybe like 2 months or so. and i try my best to not take it most years because if i can help it i wont take it (it isnt until i start gettin agressive, or overly upset over things that i take it ), some people just want to make sure they are numb and try to get on as much meds as possible for no reason, its so stupid to see people who are leading normal, healthy, and happy lives try to get on meds they dont need. but to each his own, and for the most part i have salvia to help, which does alot of good for me, i use when i start getting bad, and the next 2 or 3 days are so easy to get by

[Synchronium]

This stuff is incredibly interesting, you gotta wonder where it going to take us. I was reading about these new drugs that are being developed for normal people to take just to feel good. It will be marketed to the general population without any kind of disorder simply just to feel better on a daily basis. The question is will these drugs actually make you feel better overall? I think that happiness is relative and that in order to truely be happy you have to also experience the other side, sadness. If people take drugs like this I think what will end up happening is people will enter a state of what you may call 'soma' where they are essentially zoned out from everything and don't really feel happy or sad, just neutral and unemotional all the time. Synchronium, do you happen to know anything about these new drugs?

Also I had another question. I know that people report a mild psychedelic state when they take MAOIs like S. rue. So how does an MAOI induce this? Or do you think there are other chemicals in the plant responsible for the effect?

I don't know about any funky new drugs, but we can get 5-HTP pills over the counter here. 5-HTP (5-Hydroxytryptophan) is a natural precursor to 5-HT (5-hydroxytryptamine, AKA Serotonin), so increasing the amount of 5-HTP in your body will lead to an increase in 5-HT, resulting in a mood lift. Sort of. More info here. Interesting speculation about a zombie nation - it could happen if everyone started using happy pills all the time, but chronic use by the majority of the population is probably never goint to occur. One use you might find for them is on comedown days after ecstasy use, replenishing your neurotransmitter stock.


skagardener: You can get lamps for your desk that are about 10x as bright as a regular lamp, simulating the sunlight of summer. These are used as a treatment for Seasonal Affective Disorder (or SAD, hah!); a seasonal depression brought about during winter. Exposure to this bright light for at least 2 hours a day (ie, on next to you when you're at your PC, or at work or something) relieves the depression for about 85% of cases. You might not have SAD, but if you're getting depressed during winter, this could be an aternative to the anti-convulsants you're taking now. More info here.

[MstryShovel]

yeah a coment about the sun lamps, they work, or at least the idea does. I dont have SAD but i do have, or did have depression problems when i was younger, one of the things, along with exercise (doing pushups till im maxed(simply cant do anymore)) when i got depressed, was simply going outside(i was a recluse computer geek as a kid, hhah well still am), i learned that humans are kinda like plants but instead of producing chlorophil in the sun we produce (i think it was) vitamin b12 or soemthing, this helps regulate mood aswell as keep you healthy overall.  Another simple method i used to fight my depression was sleep.  I used to never go to bed untill 4am and then have to wake up by 7 to go to school. so after a week of this kinda bs, it wears on you. and now as an adalt whenever Im feeling down i just look back and most of the time its been because im getting 3-4 hours sleep while working for 12-16 hours back to back days.

anyways hope this helps dunno if thats especialy your problem

[skagardener]

i have heard of these lamps, but truthfully dont know where to get one, and also dont feel like spending 100 bucks on one (dont know  if this is what they cost, but im pretty sure they are over piriced ) also would they be ok for salvia as this is where she sits (my desk) and i keep myself near the desk when im home most of the time.

[MstryShovel]

its not a whole lamp fixture
its just a bulb, the lamp itself. its kinda like those "full spectrum" bulbs that imitate sunlight instead of just burning red or blue

[skagardener]

is that good for salvia? this sounds liek a way to kill two birds with one stone, as i do not think my plant is getting enough light

[MstryShovel]

well i have my plants under 2 100w bulbs and 1 60w of the "full spectrum" bulbs and they are doing fine just fine. they will do just fine under those cfl's (they look like a bulb but twisted florecent tube) i have a slight feeling that my plants would actualy do better under slighly less lumens (the output of the total setup is somewhere around 2.5-3000 lumens concidering foil reflectors and whatnot) People have sung the praises of just having one or two 42w of those floro's apparently they put out about the same lumens as a 100w equivalent, and produce far less heat, aswell as using less electricity. Ive used both and moved to the full spectrum as an experiment, I plan on expanding my grow setup into two distinct places in my room, and ill be running one with the cfl's and one with the FS bulbs. we will see.
TL;DR
but YES if you want to kill 2 birds that would work.

[Synchronium]

I hate to get back on topic () but I forgot to answer your question about taking an MAOI on it's own, Paradoxic.

Background info: Your body can only do what it's physically able to do. For example, you'll never see a new colour, because your brain can't detect and process it (for reasons I won't digress into). This also applys to the signals sent back and forth in the brain. Your brain's nerve cells only have receptors for the signals (chemical neurotransmitters) that your body makes itself - you can't add different chemical (drug) to the mix to make a new signal. What we can do though is tweak and modify the machinery (your brain) with drugs. Every drug acts to modify the existing signal that the brain is designed already to send. For example, ecstasy (MDMA) doesn't generate a new, different "super happy" signal not present normally, but instead greatly amplifies the existing signals in parts of your brain responsible for all the effects associated with E.

So, back to MAOIs - as I've mentioned, they act as a signal amplifier by stopping an enzyme (chemical factory) working that gets rid of the signal. So, if you take a particular herbal drug that's not very effective on it's own (IE Psychotria viridis) with an MAOI (IE Banisteriopsis Caapi), you'll increase the effects of the drug which is modifying your brains existing signals to produce its effect, therefore increasing the effects of the drug. (More detail on that previously in this thread.)

MAOIs on their own then - well, if your brain can already produce all the effects of a drug on it's own, and drugs only serve to modify those existing signals, if we consider what an MAOI does, it should be evident how taking an MAOI on it's own can have mild effects - the MAOI inhances your brain's normal signals, instead of amplifying the already-modified signal associated with your drug of choice. It's also worth considering that drugs only affect a few signal pathways in your brain, rather than your entire brain, so we can assume that different MAOIs do the same, for example, S. rue - perhaps it could be amplifying the normal signals of your brain specifically in the parts of the brain involved with visual perception, accounting for hallucinations?

All this is of course speculation. I'm not sat here with a book open, typing out answers. Rather trying to infer a mechanism of action from things I do know, so don't take it as 100% fact.

Cheers

[Paradoxic]

Ok that makes sense, thats basically what I would have guessed.

skagardener, I am interesting in how you use Salvia to self-medicate for depression. I read the case study about a woman who found tremendous relief from her depression with Salvia (the study is posted in the Research section). I'm curious about how you use it and specifically to what degree does it provide relief. I read that the quid (oral) method works best for countering depression (works for longest amount of time). Have you tried that?

[skagardener]

no i have never used the quid method, i have no depression symptoms though, ever. i am very content with my life. my problems lie in my bipolar disorder. i have not done salvia in about 3 weeks due to the fact that i was placed on trileptal and am not completely sure if there are any dangers between using the two together. but as far as using salvia to self medicate, i find it a very valuable tool in most circumstances. if i go through a bad phase where im snapping at everyone or becoming very frustrated often ( possibly all day for 2 or 3 days ) along with other symptoms that show through from the bipolar disorder, then i will usually do a good dose, and after that i *usually* see a large improvement in every aspect of my mood (even with anxiety, which is also another problem i have). sometimes the improvements last 2 days with the effects tapering off on the third, sometimes it doesn't usually help but a day. and as far as the quid, i have wanted to, but i guess il have to wait for my plant to do something, because right now im not sure if it is hibernating or something hope this helped answer your question, if theres anything more specific you want to know just ask

[skagardener]

and as far as the lights, i think thats a good idea so im going to pick up some stuff today. so i guess i need a growlight because maybe my plants problem is not enough light, i will prolly switch the bulbs, fluorescent while im gone during the day for its growlight, and my bulb for the nights when i am home. not sure though on which lights to get. especially the bulb for me
so is this a good growlight? http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=62579-3-29481&lpage=none
and would it work in a lamp such as
http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=191955-77383-2040-000&lpage=none
and as for my light, what kind of light is it that is used for the seasonal mood disorders? and would they both work in the same lamp fixture? (like i said i would change them during the day)

[DrYRHead]

The Harmala alkaloids in S. rue seeds are analogs of melatonin, and other tryptamines. The alkaloids probably tweak with the serotonin receptor-sites.

[JDogHerman]

Does anyone know of a way for extracting dmt from Jurema root bark?

[Arcygenical]

It's easy, but it boarders on illegality so we can't discuss it here.

[JDogHerman]

fair enough...

does anyone have any sites that they like to learn about things maybe similar to this or maybe not to this subject...